924Board.org

JackRabbit · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:03 am Post subject: Winter Driving?

So living in the Northeast, I'm wondering what will become of the Sebring once the snow starts flying. Since I have another (more practical) car my instincts tell me to take her completely out of commission and cover her in the garage until spring. They throw enough salt and shit on the roads around here to devour a car in a single season.

Does anyone drive this thing is the snow? Maybe this is a poll topic. What do you guys do in the winter? and please all you smart asses who live in Australia or Florida or wherever, I don't need to hear that you drive all winter blah blah blah I know your weather is always perfect and you get to drive your car year 'round but the rest of us will collectively exterminate you if you take this opportunity to rub it in our faces.

Cheers!
_________________
'79 Porsche 924
'05 Honda Civic
'07 BMW K1200R
'78 Honda Express
'52 Willy's
'58 Wheel Horse

tuurbo · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:11 am Post subject:

Yes I drive i81 in winter. I've also done the NJ to Chicago to Iowa run in winter in my 931.

The car will handle better in the snow than you can imagine. Take care engaging boost on corners - you'll figure it out.

Get snows. It'll handle and brake like a dream. Don't worry about rust - get it oil undercoated. The cars were rustproofed at the factory. Very well I might add.

All season tires are a hare raising experience in any car in the winter, so the Porsche is no exception.

I am driving a Hyundai Accent this winter because my car will be on jack stands for the next month, and I'm re-doing the interior. But if I had my choice, I prefer the 931 in winter - the balance is perfect and it shows in the way it handles snow.
_________________
1980 924 turbo, MSD, Meth. Inj, otherwise stock.

ideola · Joined: 01 Oct 2004 Posts: 15550 Location: Spring Lake MI

Agreed...although some of the ultra-high-season performance tires (like the Yoko's I run on the NA) do very well in the snow and ice. The bigger concern we have around these parts is bottoming out on deep snow and slush furrows. Otherwise, the car handles quite well in the slick.
_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

CorsePerVita · Joined: 25 Jul 2008 Posts: 1992 Location: Redmond, Oregon

Interesting, I was going to ask this question lol. I was curious to see how it would handle in the snow.
_________________
- 1977 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (Trackday Project)
- 1979 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (The other daily)
- 1980 Porsche 931 (Daily)
- 1987 Lamborghini Jalpa
- 1999 Ducati 900SS

JackRabbit · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:14 am Post subject:

somewhere care to explain how a rear wheel drive car with the engine up front handles in the snow? it stands to reason that with no weight over the drive wheels, I'll be all over the place. But it seems I'm hearing quite the opposite.
_________________
'79 Porsche 924
'05 Honda Civic
'07 BMW K1200R
'78 Honda Express
'52 Willy's
'58 Wheel Horse

ideola · Joined: 01 Oct 2004 Posts: 15550 Location: Spring Lake MI

Because the gearbox is over the rear wheels

51:49 weight distribution (front-to-rear). That's all you need to know

_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

tuurbo · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:26 am Post subject:

And when you engage the car forward, the weight of the car pushes to the rear of the car, over the rear wheels, which drive the car! Correspondingly, when you brake, the perfectly balanced car pushes the weight of the car to your front wheels, which do the majority of your braking!

This is NOT a Mustang. Mustangs don't have the weight balance of a Porsche. My buddy can't drive his Mustang in winter because the rear slips out.

Anyway, if you doubt it, try driving the car in winter. Then try putting a sandbag in the back - and you'll see, lol. The balance of the car is perfect without any added weight. A sandbag there just ruins your front tire's ability to dig into the snow.

Front wheel drive cars, on the other hand, are worse to drive in winter than the Porsche. Just try it. They're sloppy by comparison. The engine on a FWD car is over the front wheels, but when you take off, and the car moves, the weight of the car pushes to the rear, away from the front wheels, and you get less weight pushing on the ground for those moments.

I've driven a Porsche 931, and a BMW 528, and both cars were rear wheel drive and a dream in the snow. In both RWD cars I have far more control than a front wheel drive Honda or Hyundai. Plus, in those RWD cars I can kick the rear end out at the time of my choosing.

If you think about it, how did people manage to get around before front wheel drive?

Rear wheel drive is what people drove for the 75 years in between 'horse drawn buggy' and 'front wheel drive'. It works!
_________________
1980 924 turbo, MSD, Meth. Inj, otherwise stock.

JackRabbit · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:42 am Post subject:

tuurbo · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:44 am Post subject:

BTW front wheel drive was not created to help traction problems.

FWD is cheap to make.

Real good cars are RWD, even still.
_________________
1980 924 turbo, MSD, Meth. Inj, otherwise stock.

!tom · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:48 am Post subject:

I'd imagine a car that handles good on dry pavement would similarly handle well on wet pavement, which follows to snowy pavement, etc. Low traction conditions exacerbate handling characteristics, so if your car handles poorly in snow, that means its a poor handling car in high traction conditions too.

"They" say the 924 chassis (and its various incarnations) handles very well, so that should mean in any conditions (provided basics like ground clearance are sufficient).
_________________
78 924 NA
5-lug

CorsePerVita · Joined: 25 Jul 2008 Posts: 1992 Location: Redmond, Oregon

hahahaha it's funny that you'd say that tuurbo. My first car was a 1978 Mustang II Ghia. After driving that in the snow I was PETRIFIED of rearwheel drive in the snow. My ZX2 seems to have a very good weight distribution as a FWD car, and handles AMAZING in the snow. However, now that all this talk of the 924 in the snow is around I'm going to have to take it out and give it a whirl once she's running, sounds fun!

Low and behold as i reply to this, i found this on youtube out of curiosity.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rgx_Bz3bW9I
_________________
- 1977 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (Trackday Project)
- 1979 Porsche 924 2.0 N/A (The other daily)
- 1980 Porsche 931 (Daily)
- 1987 Lamborghini Jalpa
- 1999 Ducati 900SS

datatrain · Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:49 am Post subject: Snow

Sorry I have to take exception to the front wheel drive in the snow is bad.

My rwd BMW is very touchy in the snow. I avoid it if I can and it's my DD.

However my old Pontiac 6000 (long gone by now) with FWD was impossible to hold back in a blizzard and I had a couple of occasions to cross the Rockies in a snow storm. It was proof to me of the benefit of FWD in snow. On the long uphill grades I never spun a wheel on a snow covered road (when you could see the road).

The 924 has never seen a snowflake up close.

DAve
_________________
'78 924 NA with Collector plate
33 year old car, with me for 21 yrs
Mint '92 318i BMW
Near mint '98 Buick LeSabre
VE7HFR

Slam · Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:43 am Post subject:

Drove my 944 for years in the winter. Get the right tires and you're okay. The real problem is that there's never enough heat in the cabin and the windows take forever to clear.
_________________
'84 944 - kid blew motor
'83 944 - resting comfortably. For 12 years
'87 944 - sideswiped by trucker
'80 924 - gone
'78 924 - gone
'77 924 - rusting comfortably

Paul · Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:15 am Post subject:

Buy 4 snow tires on 15 inch wheels, put at least 150 pounds in the hatch, and install a hot thermostat.

I've driven Porsches in the winter for decades, what a blast!
_________________
White 87 924S "Ghost"
Silver 98 986 3.6l 320 HP "Frank N Stein"
White 01 986 "Christine"
Polar Silver 02 996TT. "Turbo"
Owned and repaired 924s since 1977
Porsche: It's not driving, it's therapy.

Slam · Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:43 am Post subject:

Good point about the thermostat. My 944 was okay until I redid the cooling system. Now it never overheats in summer like it used to, but the downside is it never really heats up in winter.
_________________
'84 944 - kid blew motor
'83 944 - resting comfortably. For 12 years
'87 944 - sideswiped by trucker
'80 924 - gone
'78 924 - gone
'77 924 - rusting comfortably