924Board.org

[incognitokc]

my name is ken and i just stumbled upon this car on craigs list really cheap a couple of weeks ago, i dont know much about these cars but i am learning,

the odometer says 81543 but since i got it ru nning and drove it i noticed that it does not put all the miles on while im driving, thats just issue number 1, next is i have hazard lights but no turn signals, i was told the car sat for the last 7 years or so and it has a full tank of old gas, also the gas gauge is inop, says its empty, i also have that bucking problem under load at about 4000 or 4100 rpm in 2nd through 5th gear like i said i am new to porsche ive always admired these cars but never had an opportunity to own one

i know this about my 931, i am the third owner, 1st owner bought it new in feb of 1981, manufacture date is 9 of 79, it has the 16" factory wheels 5 lug with four wheel disc brakes, all service records are recorded in the back of owners manual up through 69,475 miles

so far ive changed a brake line , clutch master cylinder, plugs wires and cap and rotor, and battery

please help!!! thanks ken

[ideola]

Welcome to the board! There's a pretty good contingent of us here from the Metro Detroit area (myself, Mr. Dude, 924RACR, GLA924SEM, etc.).

Make sure you read ALL of the articles in the FAQ...scroll down to the section on Fuel Injection and read ALL of the links there.

IMO, if the car sat for 7 years, the first thing you should do is drain out all that old gas, blow out ALL of the gas and fuel distributor lines with an air compressor, and then do the fuel sender repair. Before you refill, install a new fuel filter (make sure you install it the correct way: the direction of flow is TOWARD the windshield).

Once you've done that, put in about 5 gallons of fresh gas, along with a bottle of drygas. Get a few bottles of techron, and run that for the next 2 to 3 fillups.

Once you're reasonably certain you've cleaned out any water in the system, and once you've replaced the fuel filter, you should consider purchasing a CIS pressure tester from JC Whitney. Make sure you get the test that is specifically for the Bosch/CIS. They cost about $60. Then perform a complete CIS system test so you can isolate where your problems might be.

The bucking a 4000+ RPM sounds like either a problem with the overboost switch, fuel delivery (e.g. fuel pump, clogged line, clogged filter), or wastegate diaphragm. Sort out your fuel system first, and drive gently for now until you are able to diagnose it better.

There is also an FAQ article on the odometer repair.
http://www.924.org/techsection/GarageFAQ.htm#speedo

Out of curiosity, where was the car (what city)? There were a few floating around locally on Craigslist...just wondering which one you picked up.

Read the FAQ (yes, the WHOLE thing), use the search feature, and then if you can't find the answer, give us a shout! Best of luck!
_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[Smoothie]

The odometer problem is normal. There's a plastic gear that can split, then slip, and there's a metal gear that can slip. I'd leave it for now, until everything else is done and there's absolutely nothing else in the world to be done. When that time comes, the search function will bring up quite a few posts on the subject.

The lighting and fuel gauge problems are of course electrical. Bad grounding is common, so I'd start there and clean the five-or-so main grounding points. Get a hold of the Haynes 924 manual - it has the wiring diagrams, including ground points. Other than ground points, there can be weak (burnt/oxidized) connections at the rear of the fuse-relay panel. -Generally not fun, but rewarding to check and clean those pins. -But label the connectors A-F before removing them, and especially the single-wire connectors. They (the "G" connectors) need to be re-plugged to where they were unplugged from. Also not uncommon, is rusted-leaky cowl area just below-in-front-of the windsheild. Leaks seem to be slightly more common on the battery side, but a leak over the fuse-relay panel can drip water on it and cause problems.

The old gas... I recently used up some old gas that was sitting in my Jeep for about 5 years. Suprizingly enough, the engine started and ran on it, but not suprizingly, started and ran better with new fuel. I drained the old fuel and put it into 5-gallon containers, filtered, then diluted it at about 1:3 (25%) with fresh fuel in a couple of cars just to get rid of it.
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox

[Smoothie]

Oh yeah...the bucking around 4k can also be due to loose plumbing - there should be a small bracket between the engine block and lower charge tube holding the lower charge tube in position with the turbo. Normal failure is the single sideways bolt to the charge tube loosens, then vibrations between the bracket and bolt eventually shear through the bolt. Once that fastening is lost, that lower joint can be pushed apart under boost, air escapes, the A:F mix gets screwed-up, and the result is some moderate bucking/hesitation. Quicj check is to grab the charge tube near where it bends at the front and lift-push-down - it should feel solidly attached to the engine. If it's loose and moves independently of the rest of the engine, that bracket is either loose or missing.

Also read this - http://www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=22724
_________________
"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox

[incognitokc]

thanks for the tips,
this car was in keego harbor, the lady i bought it from bought it from her dentist in 1990 for $9000 with 69,700 miles she only drove it to the detroit yacht club on weekends, the car has never seen winter, it has been imacculatly kept the only flaws are 3 or four scratches that look like key marks from bikes or something being put away next to it in the garage, inside is super clean and well kept, it even came with porsche floormats and a dash cover that has the porsche emblem on it.
i towed it home and put the battery from my truck in it and it started right up, i just plated it last tuesday so ive driven it only about 4 times but those were the problems i encountered it also has a rattle coming from the streering box , maybe worn out bushings kind of a metal on metal rattle while driving over bumps or if you turn wheel back and forth fast

[924RACR]

Welcome!

I'd fix that steering noise quickly... had a similar noise (klunk) this past weekend in my racecar, found out it was the steering column bearings dying when the whole thing came loose mid-race. If this happens to you, you'll crash!

Can the steering wheel be moved up/down at all??? If so, they might likely be bad; if not, then I'd put the front end in the air and check all that - loose a-arms, bad bushings, steering rack, swaybar, tie rod ends, balljoints, upper strut mounts, etc...
_________________
Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype

[ideola]

You should also plan to change the timing belt ASAP unless you have documented proof that it was done within the last year or 30000 miles. Sounds like It's an interference motor, so you don't want to damage an entire motor for a $20 timing belt.

Also forgot to mention, in addition to chasing down the ground points, be sure to double check the fuses and relays...could potentially be the source of your blinker problem.
_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[incognitokc]

where do you race yours at 924 racer? i might be interested in checking that out later down the road, 696 just isnt the right place to open this thing up!!!

[incognitokc]

do any of you metro detroiters ever get together and kick each others tires?
i think it would be cool to get together with fellow 931 owners im sure everybody knows something that the next guy dont know and we could benifit from others knowledge

[924guy]

congrats! welcome the wonderfull and addictive world of the 931....if your not crazy yet, you will be soon, but in a good way!

im impressed that the fuel still fired..im in a race against time right now after having brought my 78 down from up north... need to get my tank drained and flushed before the fl heat turns my fuel into varnish.. if it hasnt already ...

sounds like you found a nice example, and youve got some great resources local to you, best of luck with the new toy !
_________________
Eric
78 924
82 931 SE "smokey"
99' VehiCross
Y2K Honda Insight
http://www.cardomain.com/id/924Guy
Performance by Pasha

[incognitokc]

the thing about my odometer is that ive driven the car something like forty miles and about 13 have been recorded also when i reset the trip odometer it will climb to 9 miles and then stop what i noticed is if i reset it when it stops then the miles on the car start recording again,
this is not really even an issue for me now down the road perhaps but my min concerns are the bucking and the turn signals so i have added and replaced most of the ground cables and ran a new one in from the engine to the factory ground block on the underdash so i guess the next step is to check the connectors in the fuse box

[skytrooper]

Welcome !

You will find a wealth of information and answers here. You will also find that these cars are addicting. I have 2 and I am always looking for others. I hope you get the problems sorted quickly. I would definitely get a new timing belt...just repairing the damage one breaking will cause to these engines will most likely cost more than the car. It is cheap insurance.
_________________
Matt

1987 - 924S "Black Pearl"
1982 - BMW 633CSi
1984 - BMW 528e
1983 - 944 N/A "Blue Max" (Gone)
1981 - 931 "Scarlet Harlot" (Gone)
1976 911S Targa (Gone)

[Paul]

Don't start it again until you check the timing belt!!!!!
_________________
White 87 924S "Ghost"
Silver 98 986 3.6l 320 HP "Frank N Stein"
White 01 986 "Christine"
Polar Silver 02 996TT. "Turbo"
Owned and repaired 924s since 1977
Porsche: It's not driving, it's therapy.

[ideola]

Ken
924RACR tracks his car in the ITB class out at Waterford Hills, not too far at all from Keego...their next event is 28-29 June.

The odo problem you describe is absolutely consistent with the required repair described in the FAQ I linked to earlier. So, when you're ready, that repair process should fix your problem.

To re-reiterate what Paul and I said above, you really really should install a new timing belt and new tensioner before driving it any further. This is an easy and inexpensive preventive maintenance item that could cost thousands to remedy if left unattended (read: complete valve job with possible piston damage).

As for a metro Detroit GTG, the last one we did was Memorial Day 2005. We've met up individually from time to time as needed, but haven't done a real get together...schedules are challenging. I'd love to see a summer get together...maybe I'll start a separate thread on that when I return from DC later this week.
_________________
erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[924RACR]

What he said...

Just to clarify, though - the NA racecar is the one I drive at the track - the turbo is a street car, and has only been on the track once. To get your car on track, you should look into either the OTD (Open Track Days) that Waterford holds (there's one this weekend, actually) or the various car club Driver's Education events (DE's), starting with, of course, Porsche Club. There are two local PCA chapters, Rally Sport (which I'm a member of, but is located more in the A2/Plymouth area - I used to live there) and South-East Michigan, which is a little more geographically oriented towards Oakland County.

But it's much the same/overlapping crowd that shows up to the events anyway!

PCA DE's are around $150 each, one day, IIRC, and usually on a weekday at Waterford. You'll also need to get your car to pass tech inspection, which means it needs to be in good mechanical condition; when you're at that point, I can help pre-tech your car (I'm not officially authorized to sign off on a tech inspection, but can certainly give a preview and help provide guidance) and make sure you're ready before you go to the trouble of the full-blown tech inspection. Since I'm over in Royal Oak, just off of Woodward, it wouldn't be too far anyhow, and likely closer for you than the official inspection.

Yeah, you REALLY need to change that timing belt immediately. Do a search - valves are unavailable for these engines now, and the belt is stupid cheap and not hard to replace.

On the bucking problem, I would definitely first ensure all vacuum hoses are good, there's a lot of elbows that can leak... but then also could be issues with electrical power supply to the fuel pumps...
_________________
Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype