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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 8:47 pm Post subject: Intercooler Project :simpler=BETTER |
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been planning this install for a while, finally getting to it. I've seen all these complicated set ups, that seem like a pain in the butt, with tiny intercoolers, or worse the Top mount!
SO I found a FMIC, the "V" mount style, only $80 on ebay! looks pretty decent, and the core size is bigger than a 951, with double the frontal area!
it's core is 23x13, and fits perfectly infront of the Radiator (I have removed the A/C condenser)
Now the only problem I've run into, is seems like Ill have to get rid of the pop-up headlights as the mechanism would hit the IC pipe. OR if you are getting rid of the CIS for EFI, that would eliminate the need for Fixed headlights. (but I have always planned on Fixed headlights anyway so It's not a big deal for me.
Only real mod is punching a couple holes for the IC inlet/outlet you can see it just to the right of the headlight mechanism in the PIC (havent fitted the 90 silicone hose yet)
Note, Ill be going to a 135* silicone hose around the CIS meter.
Also Im using 2.25" diameter tubing, (2.5 is really un-necessary) and the outlets of the IC are 2.5"
_________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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MOTANUL
Joined: 19 Nov 2018 Posts: 214 Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST
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Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2021 7:30 am Post subject: |
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The problem of the space between the engine and the radiator is a real one. I failed to put the original cover for toothed belt. I'm talking about stock equipment now.
Trying to add something there is praised!
Try to protect the gas pipes over the IC pipe. The original protection is broken in that area. _________________ 1980 Porsche 924 Turbo (931) diamond silver metallic/helios blue metallic
sold Porsche 924 NA 1979 |
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Rasta Monsta
Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 11724 Location: PacNW
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Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2021 9:17 am Post subject: |
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Gonna run hot. _________________ Toofah King Bad
- WeiBe (1987 924S 2.5t) - 931 S3
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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2021 10:45 am Post subject: |
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ill eventually convert to a larger all Radiator, and Im deflecting the ducting behind the nose vents to go into the IC/rad area.
also will eventually go EFI. Plus I live in CO, so the temps stay fairly cool, won't be driving this on hot days. Additionally I have a manual switch for the second cooling fan. _________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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Fasteddie313
Joined: 29 Sep 2013 Posts: 2596 Location: MI
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Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:27 am Post subject: |
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Looks like a nice IC if you don’t mind loosing your pop up lights..
Rad can be spaced back on the bottom a good 2 inches if you need more room..
Mine has bottom mounts just like yours and I found a good way to mount it solid..
[img] http://s1366.photobucket.com/user/edleclair/media/IMG_20150623_193321_632_zpsa0m2maup.jpg.html[/img]
See the spacers between the rad bottom mounts and the rad mounts on the lip, and the piece of angle iron running across, with the bottom of the IC bolted through that angle iron..
Mine is 4.5 inches thick at the tanks with 3” in/out though so you wouldn’t need as much spacer..
The mounting worked out fabulous though..
Mine is EMUSA too, lol.. no problems with mine yet and it’s seen 25..
Also no engine temp problems at all with my stock rad, and I log it so I would know..
Bunch more pics here. https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-944-951-968-forum/876941-hybrid-turbo-and-fmic-on-931-a.html _________________ 80 Turbo - Slightly Modified
Last edited by Fasteddie313 on Thu Jan 28, 2021 1:21 am; edited 2 times in total |
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924RACR
Joined: 29 Jul 2001 Posts: 8816 Location: Royal Oak, MI, USA
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Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:41 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, I did a similar thing as Eddie with mine, spacing (actually leaning) back the radiator to give more room for the 951 IC pipes over the top, so as to keep the headlight linkage... and then a bolt-in piece of 6061 aluminum to reinforce the very hogged-out top rad mounting.
Though I think this kind of IC looks easier and cheaper, possibly more efficient, than the 951 style is these days... probably the smarter way to go now. _________________ Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype |
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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:37 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, the 951 IC is ok But more frontal area is better. (plus you dont have to cut up the panel as much.
I guess if i was going to keep both the CIS and the pop-ups it might be an issue, but since i have always planned on getting rid of both i didnt care, and one I get rid of the CIS it will be a straight shot between the turbo and IC. but for the moment I just want to keep the car running, so Ill go around the CIS, it actually fits pretty well if it wasnt for the headlight linkage.
(and lets face it, the stock headlights suck!, I put fixed HID projectors in my 951, way better lighting!)
also I didnt need to move the rad back, with out the condenser it fits just fine. _________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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MOTANUL
Joined: 19 Nov 2018 Posts: 214 Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST
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Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:07 am Post subject: |
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MikeDanger wrote: | Additionally I have a manual switch for the second cooling fan. |
Can you help me with more details? I would like to do the same.
35-40 degrees are common in summer and the operation of the second fan would be helpful in this situation. _________________ 1980 Porsche 924 Turbo (931) diamond silver metallic/helios blue metallic
sold Porsche 924 NA 1979 |
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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 9:09 am Post subject: |
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MOTANUL wrote: | MikeDanger wrote: | Additionally I have a manual switch for the second cooling fan. |
Can you help me with more details? I would like to do the same.
35-40 degrees are common in summer and the operation of the second fan would be helpful in this situation. |
Well basically, when you turn on the A/C it turns on the second fan, Now I have removed my A/C, but what happens is the Round 1-2-3 knob turns on the second fan, you could simply pull that connector off or add a wire with a switch. (which is what I did) _________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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MOTANUL
Joined: 19 Nov 2018 Posts: 214 Location: ROMANIA BUCHAREST
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Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:06 am Post subject: |
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ok - Thanks. I am very tempted to do the same. _________________ 1980 Porsche 924 Turbo (931) diamond silver metallic/helios blue metallic
sold Porsche 924 NA 1979 |
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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Sun Apr 25, 2021 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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update, started to finish the piping routing
_________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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Carrera RSR
Joined: 08 Jan 2010 Posts: 2309 Location: Somerset, UK
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Posted: Sun Apr 25, 2021 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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MikeDanger wrote: | Yeah, the 951 IC is ok But more frontal area is better. |
That’s a one dimensional viewpoint. Not if the pipe work to and from the IC is more complicated and the larger front IC is flow restrictive.....frontal area is irrelevant. _________________ 1980 931 - forged pistons, Piper cam, K27/26 3257 6.10 hybrid turbo, 951 FMIC, custom intake, Mittelmotor dizzy & cam pulley, H&S exhaust, GAZ Gold, Fuch'ed, Quaife
Now www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=34690
Then www.924board.org/viewtopic.php?t=31252 |
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Cedric
Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 2616 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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Carrera RSR wrote: | MikeDanger wrote: | Yeah, the 951 IC is ok But more frontal area is better. |
That’s a one dimensional viewpoint. Not if the pipe work to and from the IC is more complicated and the larger front IC is flow restrictive.....frontal area is irrelevant. |
Flow restriction is not always a massive issue, it all depends on what turbo you have. If you push a standard turbo then yes, its very important because otherwise flow restriction will drive the compressor of the chart pretty quickly. If you have a big turbo, its less of an issue. If you have a knock sensitive engine, getting the lowest possible IAT might be more important than some extra flow restriction. As usual, in reality it all depends on what the best trade of will be. Pipes in general dont have that large losses, overly tight bends might add a bit, and mostly the entry to the IC and the IC itself are important factors for pressure loss.
I dont find this solution that simple, but its fun to see yet another take on the challenge, its kind of hard to win here _________________ 1980 924 Turbo
www.instagram.com/garagecedric/ |
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Fasteddie313
Joined: 29 Sep 2013 Posts: 2596 Location: MI
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Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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I’ve come to think that turbos flow so much volume (at relatively low pressure) that a cubic foot or so of intake piping and IC internal volume are basically nothing..
What if my IC intake added volume is 20 liters?
That’s 40 engine revolutions on a 2 liter 4 stroke..
3k RPM that’s less than 1 second of flow..
Airplate reaction vs TB seems instantaneous.. _________________ 80 Turbo - Slightly Modified |
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MikeDanger
Joined: 21 Nov 2002 Posts: 770 Location: Denver
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Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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BAM: was actually fairly easy.
the IC goes to about the top of the bumper
_________________ It was either this or a giant box of legos |
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