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H2O Methanol kit

 
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Ghostcloak  



Joined: 15 Mar 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:29 am    Post subject: H2O Methanol kit Reply with quote

What are your guys opinion about installing a H2O/Methanol kit to a 924 turbo? I definately will NOT use NO2.

1) I don't like how NO2 might blow the engine.
2) NO2 is rough on the engine... I want to have fun with this car while at the same time keeping it away from excessive abuse..
3) NO2 are for wusses

However, I've heard some good things about methanol. Its safer, runs cooler... just thought I'd ask your guy's opinions on this...

Thanks ^_^
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8030
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually kinda sorta have something like that in place already. I installed a headlight washer pump in its' usual location toward the bottom of the washer fluid reservoir. A line from that comes up to a small plastic fuel filter, where it makes a 90 turn over to the airbox where I've it plumbed to spray back toward the air metering plate through a small nozzle that was removed from a garden mister. The pump gets switched on by a pressure switch that closes at approx. 5 psi of boost. Approx. 13 pics starting about here including my old homemade copper tube nozzle - http://www.flickr.com/photos/9754161@N02/739687612/in/set-72157600685471748/
Approx. 6 pics here of the newer gardem mister nozzle - http://www.flickr.com/photos/9754161@N02/738834727/in/set-72157600685471748/
I say it's kinda sorta like what you describe because it's using windsheild washer fluid which happens to include some methanol (as antifreeze) plus water.

-And an olde favorite shot of the newer nozzle in operation - I dedicate this one to the memory of Rube Goldberg -

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'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox


Last edited by Smoothie on Fri Mar 27, 2009 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15505
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, are you serious? Tell me more. What does this do for you, Smoothie?
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Ghostcloak  



Joined: 15 Mar 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Definately... This is something I've got to hear about!! lol..

Any other suggestsion/comments/opinions/remarks about adding methanol to my system? What kind of gains can I expect? I know my friend has meth. in his mustang, gave him a 50 hp gain. My friends integra only got about 5 or 10 hp gain though, and they used the similar setups according to their cars design. I mean.. I really don't want to blow 200 bucks on something that'll give me only 10 hp... I'd rather upgrade exhaust or something...
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
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Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know about methanol injection and how much is used, etc. Actually, there's so little of it used in the setup I have that I'd have to call it just water injection - what that does is lessen the engines' tendency to knock. I installed it for that reason as some insurance against engine damage when the boost is turned up. Also, as a side benefit, it helps to keep the combustion chamber clear of carbon buildup.
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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Ghostcloak  



Joined: 15 Mar 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So i take it its just a nice thing to have as it helps keep the engine clean? If so, that sounds good to me! >_> First, I need to BUY the car... then i'll install it... got it
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
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Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I might have guessed wrong on the amount of methanol I'm using -
http://www.dieselsitetoo.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=269 wrote:
most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% Methanol and 58% water.
, but the fluid only gets used full strength during winter. For the rest of the year, I've been diluting it 50:50 which would result in a possible max of 20% methanol.

Some more info on the whys and hows -
http://users.frii.com/maphill/wi.html
http://www.snowperformance.net/
http://member.newsguy.com/~gtfour/skeptics.html
http://www.heibar.com/body_myth.html

Obviously the setup I have injects the fluid before the turbo and I've seen it mentioned a few times that that's not a good idea. Makes sense - with water droplets hitting compressor blades that can spin at 100000 rpm or more - you'd think bad things should or at least could happen. As it's turned out, my turbo apparently hasn't been damaged, but for anyone thinking about doing it, I'd suggest using a higher pressure pump and injecting after the turbo.
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Kenodog  



Joined: 25 Jun 2003
Posts: 2584
Location: Vancouver,B.C.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Smootie where did you get the pressure switch ?
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
Posts: 8030
Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That came from a place called Spearco quite a few years ago. As far as I can tell, they don't sell them anymore, but if I were looking to replace it now I'd try one from Air Logic - http://www.air-logic.com/oldsite/Switches/switches.html
-Don't know off-hand who's selling them though.
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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Kenodog  



Joined: 25 Jun 2003
Posts: 2584
Location: Vancouver,B.C.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks buddy.
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1981 931, Sabine
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2019 KTM 790 Adventure
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ideola  



Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 15505
Location: Woodstock IL

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smoothie, thanks for the links. Very very very interesting reading. This might go on my todo list for the 931!
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Smoothie  



Joined: 01 Jan 2003
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Location: DE (the one near MD, PA, NJ)

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One more - http://oldschool.supracentral.com/htm/h2o.htm (and scroll down)
Sadly they refer to my Spearco pressure switch there as "quite cheesey", but it's interesting nonetheless. It gets more involved than I did in engineering the system to match the needs of the engine at different boost levels, etc.

They mention using a 0.031" nozzle for the Supra Turbo with a 2 stage pump (2 pumps with the fluid flow hooked-up in series). The opening of the mister nozzle that I'm using (that's mister as in mist, not "Mr. Nozzle" ) I measure at approx. 0.042" (a piece of 0.042" safety wire fits the opening pretty snug). -So although I still haven't applied any good science to it, I'd say I'm getting reasonably similar output with the larger nozzle, but lower pump pressure.
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"..it's made in Germany. You know the Germans always make good stuff."


'82 924T, US version, dark green metallic, 5 speed Audi 016G gearbox
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