924Board.org

[ideola]

First off, I've just acquired a 1981 924 NA with 125K+ miles on it. Only two previous owners, but subject to some neglect and stupidity by the last owner. Have no idea how well the engine was cared for.

Question regarding synthetic oil...there's little doubt that older engines that have developed "slop" can suffer leakage from synthetic oils because the rings may not properly seal once a synthetic oil gets in there. I have a good friend who is rebuilding his 1969 Mustang Mach I 427 Cobrajet as a result of this mistake. Clearly, I don't have as much at stake, but I really don't want to get into an engine rebuild if I can avoid it. Has anyone ever actually experienced this problem after putting synthetic oil into an early 80s car of this type? I'm more interested in anecdotal evidence than I am opinions about the relative merits of synth vs. dino.

Second question: PerformanceProducts.com is selling an interesting product called Magne-Strip. It's a powerful, flexible magnet that wraps around your oil filter. It claims to trap small metallic particulate in the filter so that it can't recirculate. Has anyone actually used one of these, and are there any opinions about whether this contraption actually provides any benefit? It's relatively cheap, and reusable, so I can't see the harm in trying, just wondering if it might actually work. Here's a link:
http://www.performanceproducts.com/ProductPage.aspx?ProductName=Magnetic+Oil+Filter+Band&productid=103932&producttype=10

[Lizard]

in regards to the synthetic oil. I run it in my 1978 though I have no idea how many miles I have on the car, but the cyl walls look recently honed so I am unsure. although you will not have any issues with leaking past rings, what you will have issues with is leaking past the main seals and the camshaft seal, and possible the oil pan and valve cover, so what you could do is to remove the engine from the bay, and replace the rear main the oil pump seal, and the oil pan gasket (which is probably leaking now anyway), and the valve cover gasket, reinstall fill with synthetic and you will be fine.

in regards to the magnet, not sure about the wrap around one, but if you are worried about metal particals then get a rare earth magnet and on next oil change put it on the backside of the oil drank plug and it will trap them all in the bottom of the engine and will be removed when you change the oil next.
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3 928s,

[ideola]

[Lizard]

any old earth magnet, but try to get one as large a possibly with out having a lip that hangs over to knock it off.

and in regards to the no leaks on the pan, then I would just drain the oil and install synthetic.
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3 928s,

[924RACR]

I would expect that the filter medium should catch the metal anyway, but I can't see if hurting...

As for synth, that's all I run in my 924's... Mobil1 in the turbo (original engine, 166kmi and counting, haven't taken it apart at all) and Redline synthetic in my racecar - expensive stuff, $8/qt, but worth it for that expensive motor, obviously a new (freshly built) motor broken in on standard Castrol dino oil, makes great power, and probably won't leak anymore now that I have the breather fixed... never had any issues leaking previously with synthetic.
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Vaughan Scott
Webmeister
'79 924 #77 SCCA H Prod racecar
'82 931 Plat. Silver
#25 Hidari Firefly P2 sports prototype

[ideola]

How fitting that Vaughan and Lizard were two people to post to my First Ever Post on 924board! Still friends to this day...cheers fellas!
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[Fifty50Plus]

Was it another oil question?
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1979 924 NA race car
1982 924 NA race car - Sold
1982 924 Turbo almost a PoS
1981 924 Turbo a real PoS, new engine
1982 924 Turbo nice body, blown engine
1972 911 E race car - going to Vintage
Various 944s to become IT-S race car

[ideola]

Apparently I hadn't learned to use "search" yet
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erstwhile owner of just about every 924 variant ever made

[maybeoneday]

First off not a whole lot of experience with 924 in particular, but a lot of experience with auto mechanics in general and I have heard this oil theory many times. My opinion (based on what I have seen) is that using the correct weight is more important than synth vs dino in older cars (ie too thin can cause sealing issues in older cars with ring wear), but even in these cases it probably only makes the ring wear issue show up slightly earlier than it otherwise would have. Having said that I almost always use Dino or semi synth 15w40 or 20w50 in older cars (depending upon manufacturers original spec)

On the second note almost anyone with a modern auto trans car has probably used something similar to the magnet that you are describing. For example when you do an auto trans service on an early boxter tiptronic you will find 2 or 4 small rare earth magnets in the bottom of the trans sump for exactly the reason you describe (removing small metal particles). I am always surprised by how many metal filings are stuck to them when you do the service. This is probably telling me that something similar in the sump may not be a bad idea. Having said that you would probably be better with the trans magnets placed directly in the oil sump/pan and only changing them when you do a sump/pan gasket. This would equal about the same amount of time as a trans service (probably less even), and even though I am surprised by how many filings end up stuck to them, there always seems to be enough room left on them when you do a trans service . I would guess that the trans magnets are more magnetic too, but this is only a guess.
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1977 924 NA Auto

[maybeoneday]

opps just saw the date of that post... now I get it. well you can add that reply to the archive. 10 years on 924 board congrats.
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1977 924 NA Auto

[pcelenta]

a couple of years back I took my 308 to a shop for an engine oil change and a gear box oil change. This well know independent ferrari shop put synthetic in the engine and the gear box. the car never leaked a stitch of oil the 10 plus years prior...after the synthetic I was getting leakage from just about every fiber/paper seal...and the gear box situation was a disaster....the noted 1st to 2nd change (same as on our 931's) was virtually impossible to get in with out a horrible grinding sound. switched it all back to dino and things got back to normal....engine oil leakage stopped and gear box was once again functioning properly. perhaps on a freshly rebuilt vintage engine it is a different story. from what I heard about the gearbox...the Porsche style synchros used in th 308 gear box do not like synthetic.

[ideola]

[v8carreragts]

I've been using AMSOil in everything sin 1980 without any issue.

The only thing that can happen to rings (provided you use a good brand) is that most upper level brands use a much better detergent and this will clean the carbon out from around the rings. Also the leakage problem is usually because the seals get the years of accumulation cleaned off and then begin to leak. Lots of leaks are kept sealed by deposits.

Good synthetic oil is far superior to any other oil in every way. It has much better lubrication characteristics including higher film strength and shear capacity, it has a much better additive package, it has a lower temperature pour point, a higher flash point.

I don't know about other synthetics but I have used and have had no problems with AMSOil in anything. I use their oil, grease, gear oil and auto trans fluid. The only non synthetic that i don't use is CV grease because AMSOil doesn't make any for this purpose.
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84 944--924 Carrera GTS clone w/520HP Chevy 302 V8--RUNNING!
2015 AUDI Q7
2013 Dodge Charger R/T AWD HEMI
2013 Chevy Cruze

[maybeoneday]

[v8carreragts]

With better oil (AMSOil) you can run extended oil change intervals if you use their bypass filter. I change my oil once/yr. or 12,000 miles with a filter change at 6 mo/6000 miles.

Financially it is good. Also, what sold me originally were 3 things. First, the 924 that i was driving was difficult to start when the temp was below 0 F. When i changed to AMSOil I went to a banquet and when I left to go home the temp was -20 F. The car cranked like it was warm.

The second was with the transaxle. When the temp was below 0 F i needed to warm up the car some before i could let out the clutch. Otherwise it would kill the engine. (drag from thick gear oil) After I changed to AMSOil the problem was gone.

Third, I used to own a Buick Skyhawk with a 1.8L turbo engine. At one point I lost oil pressure -- went to 0. When i put a mechanical gauge on it it also read 0. I had a used car warranty and they had me bring it to the dealer that I bought the car from which was a ford dealer. They, as the service manager told me, ran the hell out of it and couldn't figure out what was wrong so they sent it to the Buick dealer across the street for repairs. While it was there i stopped in to see what they found and talked to the mechanic. He told me that he drained the oil and clean oil came out, he expected to find a very slugged up engine where the oil was changed after the problem to try to make it appear that the oil had been changed routinely. But he was stumped when he took the engine apart and clean oil came out of everywhere. He couldn't believe how clean the engine was inside. What had happened was the oil pickup tube cracked and the pump was sucking air. all the engine needed was a new oil tube. The bearings and the cam had no measurable wear or burning. The turbo was sent to a rebuilder and found to be in perfect condition as well.

So I use it in everything. as far as I am concerned, other oil is junk.
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84 944--924 Carrera GTS clone w/520HP Chevy 302 V8--RUNNING!
2015 AUDI Q7
2013 Dodge Charger R/T AWD HEMI
2013 Chevy Cruze